Super Mario Bros.

Speaker

Jon

We’ll go in five, four, three. Welcome back. Gen X grownup podcast listeners to this backtrack edition of the Gen X grownup podcast.

Jon

I am John joining me as always. Of course, my buddy Mo. Hey man.

Mo

Hey, how’s it going?

Jon

Good it would not be a show without George, hey George.

George

Hey, how’s it going everybody?

Jon

In this episode, we’re celebrating a true milestone in gaming history, the 40th anniversary of Super Mario Brothers. The 85 classic didn’t just put Nintendo on the map, it redefined what video games could be, inspiring generations of players.

Jon

We’ll discuss its legacy, explore how it became a cultural icon, and look at why Mario’s first big adventure still holds up all these years later. I was thinking 40 years.

Jon

Like, I was okay we did the 40th anniversary of things that happened in 75 and 80 and kind of 81.

Mo

Yeah,

Jon

This is 1985, 40 years ago now.

Mo

yeah I know.

Jon

And it makes me just feel, God, how old Mo must feel, knowing ah even 85 is now 40 years ago.

Mo

Oh, I don’t to, okay.

Jon

Certainly.

Mo

I mean, I’m not going to, I mean, I’m not going to say that we’re having our 40th high school reunion this year. i won’t mention that part.

Jon

No, let’s not say that.

Mo

I won’t, i won’t talk about that, but yeah.

Jon

Wow.

George

three

Jon

Oh, man, it’s it it it really snuck up on me because when we were prepping for this episode, I’m like, oh, the 40th anniversary. That must have been what? Eighty one, eighty two. it’s eighty five. What?

Mo

Yeah.

Jon

but Eighty five.

Mo

Yeah.

Jon

I’m like, yeah. So it’s a truly milestone game. As I said just a minute ago, there’s so much interesting stuff to learn and talk about. And it’s it’s crazy that it is still today.

Jon

Still today. People play for the first time and enjoy it. We’re going to get into all of that in the body of this show. First, though, it is time for some fourth listener email. Anybody that takes time to write in, you are our fourth listener, assuming the three of us do listen, George.

Jon

But if you don’t, that’s okay. ah I have a couple of quick emails. The first is from Diana D. And she wrote in with the subject line, Summertime Podcast.

Jon

And she says, love the podcast. Summer in the 70s.

Mo

Good start.

Jon

Yeah, right. Perfect start. Summer in the 70s. Pure bliss.

Mo

oh

Jon

I was the youngest of two older brothers. I was talking to the middle sibling. I say, you know, I don’t remember us ever having. What? I was talking to the middle sibling. Oh, and I say, you know, you know, I don’t remember us.

Jon

That’s oddly written.

Mo

And I say, you know, it is.

Jon

Yeah. Okay. Okay. I was talking to the middle sibling and I say, you know, I don’t remember us ever having jarts. Oh, we didn’t. Mom and dad knew the oldest would use us as target practice. ah

Jon

So ah just ah preemptive parent, preemptive parenting there, you know, probably some wise choices. And then I think, George, you mentioned Panama City as part of the summertime stuff. Panama City Beach in the 70s was the shit, Diana says.

Jon

The treasure ship, Captain Anderson’s getting an airbrush shirt at the surf hut.

George

Yeah. Captain Anderson’s.

Jon

Yeah, you remember that?

Mo

ah George is nodding away.

George

Yeah. Yeah.

Jon

yeah Yeah.

George

Every single bit of that.

Jon

Yep.

George

Absolutely.

Jon

Yep. Thanks for a great podcast, Diana. Thank you, Diana. And one more quick one. And I had to grab this one because of the subject from Dustin F. He said, George and RoboCop.

George

Wait, whoa, whoa, whoa.

Jon

Okay.

Mo

Okay.

George

Hold on.

Jon

Yes.

George

I’m, I’m reading what you put in here.

Jon

Mm hmm.

George

You don’t need to put two fucking emails at the beginning of the podcast to You just did this shit just to mess with me.

Jon

Well, um hold on. I’m checking the… Yes, it says here I did it to mess with you. Those are in my notes.

George

Yeah, yeah.

Jon

Exactly. Yes. Okay. Justin says, hey, bros, I have a chance to point out a time when George was wrong, so who could pass that up? in the

George

I mean, we could right now.

Jon

We definitely we could. We could skip ahead, but I’m not going to. well you let’s take it Let’s take a vote, actually. So, a Mo, would you like to skip ahead?

Mo

All right, yeah, vote’s fair. no

Jon

No, okay. I’m not going to skip ahead. so Sorry, George. Sorry.

George

I didn’t think senior citizens could vote, but all right, let’s go.

Jon

Oh, well, for now, we’re going to let ah George’s, for now, we’re going to let Mo’s vote stand, and we’ll check that out. He says, in the debate episode about movie remakes, George was adamant that Peter Weller was only in the first Robocop movie. That’s not correct. He was in Robocop 2 as well.

Jon

And I’ll step in front of the bullet. I don’t remember correcting you either. I didn’t realize that was the case.

Mo

Yeah, I’m sure I’d let let it pass.

Jon

Was he in Robocop 2?

George

I…

Jon

Okay.

George

I mean, he was in RoboCop 2. I went back and looked at it afterwards because he’s this is not the only email to point it out. But truthfully, I don’t think he wanted to be in RoboCop 2, so I’m sticking with my debate point.

Jon

okay

Jon

ah okay so but You know, Mr. Weller might be happy that you said he wasn’t in He might be changing the tides, yeah.

George

Yeah, right.

Jon

Anyway, Dustin says, thanks for all the great content and also the good times on Discord, fourth listener, DF. So, we’ll tell yeah all three of us thank you, Dustin, for your email.

Jon

I’m sorry. We’ll tell you all three of us thank you, Diana, for your email. And Mo and I thank you, Dustin, for your email, though, George will abstain, I expect.

George

yeah

Jon

oh Hey, with that good… We love it. Anytime the fourth listener drops us a line, if you’d like your email featured here on the show, it’s drop dead easy. Just hit us up at podcast at gen x grown up.com. We’ll read every single one and most of them just like Dustin’s and Diana’s will eventually make the show.

Jon

All right, let’s jump into the body of this backtrack all about Super Mario Brothers after this very quick break.

Jon

Super Mario Brothers came out in 1985. And I don’t know that we need to explain what the game is because it’s probably one of the most recognizable games and characters and worlds that’s ever existed.

Jon

um But in in a back in a backtrack where we’re talking all about this game, you really kind of want to peel back the layers of the onion and start where the origin of it, where it began, how we got there. And I, as we’re prepping for this, you know, I, I, I task Mo with, can you dig in and find some of the background and research on the origin of not just Mario, but super Mario brothers, this game.

Mo

Yeah.

Jon

And he found a lot of cool stuff. You want to get us started on just some of this background.

Mo

Yeah, and this is really going to touch the surface. There was so much on there that I could have added, but i was like, you know, it’s an hour podcast.

Jon

Hmm.

Mo

want to keep it short.

Mo

But I mean, to start with, I mean, Super Mario Brothers, it was designed by Shigeru Miyamoto and Takashi Tezuka, and they were part of Nintendo, the part of the creative department.

Jon

Mm-hmm.

Mo

um Nagato did most of the actual development on it. But again, it was it was very much like a team effort, especially when came to things like the sound design.

Jon

Okay.

Mo

i mean, it was a collaborative effort, but like yeah I think Nagato was definitely the driving force.

Jon

Mm-hmm.

George

Now, Super Mario Brothers, though, it didn’t just come from out of nowhere. It was kind of a sequel in the Mario Brothers original franchise, which itself was probably based on John’s favorite game, Donkey Kong.

Mo

Mm hmm.

George

But the original Mario Brothers got really…

Jon

What? Yep.

George

was released in 1983 as an arcade platformer takes place on a single screen it’s got that iconic black background with kind of the neon colors and whatnot if you guys remember um miyamoto used the term athletic games to refer to what would later be known as platform games so i guess maybe mario brothers might have been one of the

Mo

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Mo

h

Jon

yeah.

George

early examples of platform gamers. Um, but yeah, for super Mario brothers, he wanted to create a more colorful athletic game with a scrolling screen and larger characters, which it’s real fun.

Jon

oh hell yeah

George

How in that super Mario brothers game, he starts off small, but he doesn’t stay small.

Jon

yeah

George

Hmm.

Jon

No, that’s right.

Mo

Right.

Jon

Give me that mushroom. Yeah. While they were working. Excuse me.

Jon

While Miyamoto was. Damn it. Something in my throat. need to get a drink. Okay. Sorry.

Jon

Now Miyamoto, he’s no newcomer to games. I mean, he Donkey Kong, hello, you were talking about, right?

Mo

No, I’m close.

Jon

So they’re working on other games for the NES, which was just about to come out. I guess it was Famicom in Japan, I guess, and eventually came over here as the NES. ah While working on Excitebike, Excitebike, how do you say Excitebike or Excitebike, the one with ah yeah the jumping bike and Kung Fu, great Nintendo game.

George

Excite Mike. Yeah.

Mo

Oh, that was a fun one.

Jon

He came up with the concept of the platformer that would have a character strategically scrolling sideways. So working your way across the screen. Not only, like you said, George, is this an early, early example of a platformer in general.

Jon

Super Mario Brothers was the first scrolling platformer, meaning you’re not just what you see on the screen, but more is coming and you have more jumping and athletic work to do. ah You could jump long distances above ground, underground and have colorful levels um rather than just the that black background that you were talking about.

George

Yeah, and the scrolling that you’re talking about there, John, i’m just it just dawns on me that the scrolling part of it is key to that statement. Because I remember games before Super Mario Bros.

George

where you would you know platform, jump around and whatnot, and then when you get to the edge of the screen, it would just redraw the next screen.

Jon

Mm-hmm. Right.

Mo

Right.

George

It wouldn’t just scroll smoothly.

Jon

Yeah.

George

So that that’s a very cool thing. Development for Super Mario Bros., it began in the fall of 84, same time as they were developing Legend of Zelda.

Mo

Man, they just could not hit home runs, right?

Jon

lot bangers.

George

ah

Jon

Wow.

George

I know, right? That’s another one directed and designed by Miyamoto. I mean, this guy, you could say that he probably built the foundation that makes the house of Nintendo keep running to this day at this point.

Mo

Yeah.

Jon

A hundred percent. I’d agree with that.

Mo

Oh, yeah, for sure. And, you know, one of the other things that made this game so different was that they actually spent a lot of time on the soundtrack, which was something that really was not basically because of limitations on the equipment, but they found ways around that.

Jon

Yep.

Jon

Oh, yeah.

George

you

Mo

And they composer, Koji Kondo, and he created this really dynamic and exciting soundtrack that really almost made you want to keep playing the game.

Jon

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Jon

Oh.

Mo

It kind of pulled you through.

Jon

Yeah, and and you say a soundtrack, and you’re not kidding. A lot of people say, what’s the soundtrack of this game? Beep, beep, beep, beep, beep.

Mo

Yeah.

Jon

That’s just a song. mar Super Mario Brothers hat had a soundtrack, a dozen or so themes that would change based on what you did, where you were.

George

Yeah.

Jon

If you’re underground, there was a different one.

George

doo Do doooo do do do do.

Jon

The swimming song was different.

Mo

g

Jon

Yes, exactly. Yeah, if I’m worth half a damn editing, I’ll have a little music playing in the background during this part of our discussion. But… It is like I went looking and you can go and find the full soundtrack, including an alternate themes.

Jon

Like when you’re running out of time, there’s a hurry up version of a lot of the songs that pulls you through the game and adds to that.

George

Right.

Mo

yeah

Mo

Yeah.

Jon

You know, what did you say, Moe? It makes you want to keep playing.

Mo

Yeah, it makes you want to keep going, right?

Jon

It also… informs you that you’re winding up, not just like a do-doot, do-doot, do-doot. Usually it’d be a beep to tell you’re running out of time. They actually change the tempo and the timbre of the soundtrack to make it do it.

Jon

i don’t think I can overestimate how cool the soundtrack was on this.

Mo

Absolutely.

Jon

and The fact that it had a full soundtrack. And then introduction of not just things like scrolling sideways and jumping, things we take for granted now.

Jon

Power-ups.

Mo

Yeah.

Jon

Super mushroom that makes you bigger, you were talking about, George. The fire flower that makes you… You have a weapon! You can shoot stuff down.

George

Yeah.

Jon

What else we have? The star that would make you like invincible for a while.

Mo

Invulnerable, right? made you super, made just super right?

George

Invulnerable. Yeah.

Jon

i guess you could you could fall maybe off the end of the bottom of the world, but you couldn’t get hurt by anybody, right?

Mo

right

Jon

You could…

George

Right.

Jon

Oh, and a whole other song for that. If you had the star power that you were playing in there, it’s stuff we take for granted now that was all invented in this one game 40 years ago.

George

That’s right.

George

you know, it’s unique. We were talking about just now that super mushroom making you larger, the team based the level design around small Mario. So everything is proportionate to that intending to make his size bigger in the final version, but they decided it would be too fun to let Mario change his side via the power up.

George

So it’s just interesting how, when they’re developing that kind of thing, like little decisions mean big rewards at the end for the player.

Jon

Mm-hmm.

Jon

Yeah.

Mo

Yeah.

Jon

Mm-hmm.

Mo

Yeah, for sure. And, you know, one of the things that just always impresses me, and this is, I guess, you know, me being an older guy, um is just the limitations these guys had to work with to create this game.

Mo

And granted, they had the same limitations everybody else did who was creating games at the same time, know, for Nintendo.

Jon

Mm-hmm.

Mo

But they had, I think, about 250K of cartridge space and like thirty two k of actually programming space And they only had like 64K of like for graphics, basically.

Jon

Mm-hmm.

Jon

Mm-hmm. Yep.

George

wow

Mo

And that, I mean, to me, that’s just incredible. And they, I was reading, do some reading and they did a lot of really just super clever things. Like there are places where it’s actually the same image, like, but maybe upside down in a different color or that you don’t see that it’s, you just see it as a different character, different graphics.

Jon

yep

Mo

Yeah.

Jon

Yeah. You know, when you talk about size limitations like this, you know, um Mo, you and I have had this discussion dozens of times, maybe a couple of times on air, but it’s sometimes it’s those restrictions that lead to some of the coolest innovation and game mechanics.

Jon

It also reminds me just how impressive it is that We look back, now this is a generation ahead of the Atari 2600 and the television stuff like that.

Jon

And those games, we’re talking like four k you know, how much smaller it was.

Mo

yeah

Jon

And to think that, it’s You look at it like, well, what a leap it was to the n NES. Well, of course it was such a leap. Look at the greater capacity. But still, though it’s dozens of times greater than we had on the Atari, it’s still a minuscule amount of data to create an immersive world like they did here.

Mo

Oh, tiny.

Jon

It’s it’s it’s incredible.

George

I will say that I feel like what they did with the Nintendo specifically was larger than the leap in numbers.

Mo

Mm-hmm.

Jon

Yeah.

George

Like what was it? Uh, eight bit to 16 bit or whatever.

Mo

Yeah.

George

Uh, you know, double the capacity. I think they more than doubled the game.

Jon

More than. Yeah.

George

Yeah. The entertainment value of stuff on Nintendo and super Nintendo later, which I know is another generation of, I feel like they did so much more than just double the amount.

Jon

Oh, yeah.

Jon

Skyrocket.

Jon

Sure. Right, right.

Mo

yeah

George

And it, I’m not throwing shade at my Atari 2600 cause I love my Atari 2600, but I’m not going to compare a little square in adventure to super Mario in super Mario brothers.

Mo

No, no.

Jon

Right. They added more than just bits. They added play value that was incredible.

George

Yeah.

Mo

Yeah, for sure. And was looking at an interview that they gave about the creation of the game, and they said it was they felt almost like they were given like, oh my god. We have all this memory to play with, you know in a way.

Mo

Of course, they said they quickly used it all and then had to find ways to make it efficient.

Jon

Right.

Mo

But compared, like George said, compared to what they had before this, it was like, like, oh, wow, we have all this extra space to do things, you know, and I think their ambitions are bigger than what they wanted and they could do, but then they scale it back.

Jon

Mm-hmm.

Jon

Mm-hmm. Forget it.

Jon

Yeah.

Jon

It always is. Yeah.

Mo

But, you know, they got it done.

George

Well, was kind of like when John and I had our Amigas and we just had floppy disks at first and then we got 40 megabyte hard drives and we lost our shit.

Mo

Woohoo!

George

We’ll never fill these up.

Mo

well Is it possible?

Jon

ah

Mo

Mm-hmm.

Jon

Um, actually, we did pretty damn quick.

George

Yep. Now the game debuted Super Mario Brothers was what we’re talking about here, not Mario Brothers, but it debuted in Japan on September 13th, 1985 for the Famicom, ah which was the n NES, of course, in North America, which later rolled out globally.

Jon

Yeah.

George

And we’re going to get into some of the stats in a later segment of the podcast, but trust me, They’re eye-watering. These are some big goddamn numbers.

Jon

They are.

George

Mo and John were both talking about the stuff that I found ah before we started recording, talking about just how crazy those numbers look.

Mo

Blew my mind.

George

Even in today’s mindset, like when you’re talking about video games and being sold today, these numbers are competitive.

Mo

Yeah.

Jon

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was saying, like, I knew it was huge and maybe the best. I didn’t know was that much far and above so much other stuff.

Mo

Yeah.

Jon

Yeah. So as we move into more of reminiscing and looking back on Super Mario Brothers and what made it So amazing. I want to do a quick roundtable because we all typically have different entry points of familiarity with the game.

Mo

Hmm? Hmm.

Jon

So i want to go around real quick. The three of us, what are your first memories of your discovery of Super Mario Brothers? And what do you think of when you look back on it now? let’s start with you, George.

George

You know, i yeah I don’t have much memory of playing with an NES or a Super Mario game because that came out in 85, like we just said.

Jon

Mm hmm.

George

And at that point, I was just starting high school and I was way more into the athletic side of my life than I was into the computer gaming side of my life.

Jon

Yeah.

Mo

Thank

George

I still had my Commodore 64. in my Atari 2600, but I did not have a Nintendo Entertainment System. It just wasn’t anything my parents were going to buy because you already have a gaming system, son.

George

You don’t need another one, right?

Jon

Oh, yeah.

George

um And I don’t know that I remember wanting it, but I think probably…

Jon

Yeah.

George

Six years or so later, like right around the time, John, you and I met in the, in the club at in the Star Trek club.

Jon

Yeah. Yeah.

George

I think that’s when I was doing the blockbuster rental kind of stuff, because I do have some memories of renting Nintendo consoles from them and playing games like Super Mario Brothers.

George

I think I probably played it then, but truthfully, I didn’t really pick it back up until emulation got really popular in the last year. 10 or 15 years and i still suck at it to this day i can’t play like if i get through world i’m happy right

Jon

Yeah. Yeah.

Jon

yeah yeah ah so For me, I want to say, so I was a sophomore junior, 85 in high school. So you were just starting high school. That makes sense. you know Mo was in graduate school. We know he’s much older.

Jon

ah but So I was 85.

George

right

Jon

And you know real I was into computers. I had my Atari 8-bit computer, and I wasn’t paying attention to video games.

Mo

right.

Jon

i I mean, I was playing tons of them on my computer, but those were computer games. That was big kid stuff.

George

right

Jon

you know I had sold my 2600, lamenting that and everything. ah lamenting that still, but to buy the computer and ah love that. I always thought of the NES because of the first exposure to it. It was my girlfriend’s little brother’s game.

Mo

oh right

Jon

And he knew I liked computers and crap. And so when I was over visiting their family, he, would you know, I’d be like, well, I want to see your video. Show me your thing, you know? And, and I saw the Zelda with the shiny ah gold cartridge. And I saw his super Mario and the gun where shoot the duck hunt and everything.

George

Right.

Jon

But he’s like, man, this is the one that I can’t stop playing, this Mario one. And i I didn’t get it right away. In fact, I didn’t initially get that it was supposed to be the same Mario from the Donkey Kong franchise because I didn’t see Donkey Kong.

Mo

Oh, really? Ah. ah

Jon

and And in our era, every little running man looks the same. And so it didn’t surprise me that he looked like don you know Mario did necessarily. I quickly made the connection. But I didn’t, I never had an NES until years and years later. I first had a Super Nintendo to play Street Fighter. but But when I, when I do play it and like you, I’m not great at it, George.

Jon

i do enjoy playing it, but I can appreciate when I look back how old it is, just how polished and smooth. And we’re going talk a lot about why it’s so damn popular. But I was impressed that and a little bit jealous that my girlfriend’s little brother had this game.

Jon

and I’m like, I wish I’d had that game one i um on my Atari would have been really cool. So what about you, Mo?

Mo

he

Jon

What do you, what do you remember?

Mo

Yeah, I kind of like you guys because um I was in college to start starting college when this game came out. So i was not focused on console games or anything at the time.

Jon

Right.

George

What course were you teaching?

Jon

oh

Jon

Damn! That was…

Mo

How to spot assholes.

Jon

Okay.

Mo

Anyway, they.

Jon

Ding! A bonus for George. That was really insightful one. Thank you.

Mo

That was quick. I give credit for that one. um but But anyway, so um it really wasn’t until the following summer when I came was home ah visiting a friend and he had an n NES because um and I started playing.

Jon

Mm-hmm.

Mo

And it was I remember starting to play and thinking I need to stop because this game is just way too addictive. Like, you know, guys say, hey, this let’s just go out. And I’m like, I’d rather just stay here and keep playing this, to be honest, you know, um because and then, you sort of left it alone for a while. But then, you know, after college and stuff, even a few years later, i was surprised how, you know, most games have a shelf life, right?

Mo

Like when they first come out, they’re super good.

Jon

right

Mo

And then after a few years, like, yeah, even a few years later, i was like, this is still an amazing game. You know, still really playable.

Jon

Little did we know.

Jon

yeah Yeah. So many reasons for that. so we all kind of it’s We’re kind of a similar entry point into Mario. like We weren’t the first guard playing it. We picked it up as other people did and were’re like, I’ll be damned.

Jon

It looks like that crash is over. looks like we’re getting better.

Mo

Yeah. I mean, we couldn’t not hear about it, though, that’s for sure, because it was everywhere.

Jon

No.

Mo

Everybody was talking about it.

George

Oh, yeah.

Jon

who Yep, yep. It’s on the news.

Mo

Mm-hmm.

Jon

Oh, people addicted to Nintendo.

Mo

Yeah. Yeah.

Jon

That was why. All right, we have so much more to cover in this Super Mario Brothers backtrack. Stick around, we’ll be right back.

Jon

Sorry. I haven’t, I haven’t drank anything yet today. That’s why I’m in five, four, three.

Jon

As you get into looking at just why or how or in what manner Super Mario Brothers is so beloved and so famous, we started looking at some of like the vital statistics around Super Mario Brothers.

Jon

And that’s where George liked to dig into spreadsheets and look at the numbers and stuff.

George

a

Jon

ah So, George, you want to share some of the stuff that you found?

George

Yeah. So I found fandom.com wiki on the entire franchise, not just one thing, but fortunately it broke everything up nicely into different, what you might call segments of the Mario universe, right?

Jon

Okay.

George

So ah the, the whole Mario game video game franchise has sold more than 950 million units worldwide. Now, million units worldwide now

Mo

jesus

Jon

That’s almost a billion.

George

That’s across all the different Mario, Super Mario, ah Mario in space, all that stuff.

Mo

Thank you.

George

It’s just 950 million units. Crazy. ah The main Super Mario series alone has sold more than 465 million copies worldwide of that 950 million numbers.

George

You can see Super Mario is by far the largest portion of the Mario franchise.

Jon

Yeah.

George

Now, Let’s break it down just a little bit. So Super Mario Brothers itself, the platform on NES, it sold 40 million units, roughly,

Jon

Yeah.

George

ah for a total of one point six billion dollar

Mo

Jeez Louise.

George

Now, you do the math on that, that equals out to a little over $40 a cartridge. Now, I’m curious because there’s no way, I i couldn’t find it in my stats, whether or not that includes perceived value for the pack-in Super Mario Brothers.

Jon

Yeah.

George

Because remember, it was packed in with a lot of Nintendo ah gay um console sales.

Jon

Yeah. yeah

Mo

Yeah, that’s true.

George

So I don’t know if they include that in the number or if this is just literally they sold those many units outside of the pack-in.

Jon

Yeah.

Mo

ah I mean, that number just blows me away because there are blockbuster movies that don’t hit those numbers.

George

e Oh, I’m going to get into the movies.

Jon

Right.

Mo

Oh, really? Oh, Jesus.

George

Don’t worry.

Jon

but

Mo

Okay.

Jon

ah Right.

George

Now, John, one of your favorite platforms of all time, the Game & Watch, that was released in 1986.

Jon

Right.

Jon

Yeah. Fun little guys.

George

That sold 1.2 million units for a total sale of $49 million. dollars Just the little Game & Watches.

Jon

The little handhelds.

George

And those things weren’t terribly expensive.

Jon

Yeah.

George

What were they, like $10 a piece or something like that? $9? $10? 20 bucks, whatever they were, that was in 1986.

Jon

Yeah, they’re they were small.

George

um And that’s just Super Mario Brother. If you then go look at some of their other ah parts of the system. So like we said, the entire ah video game franchise, over 950 million units, sold for over $50 billion, by the way.

George

Is it no wonder that Nintendo is not one of the largest gaming companies of all time?

Jon

Mm-hmm.

Mo

Yeah.

George

But then other media… just for Super Mario Brothers feature films, 180 million, I guess, tickets, right? Would be sold for, what is this?

Jon

yeah

George

$2.2 billion. dollars in lifetime sales. And a large portion that is probably the latest film that came out a year or two ago.

Jon

Right. Yeah. Yeah.

George

um but they started back in 1986 licensed merchandise has sold 6 billion. Um, and that’s not including all the, like the reissues and the modern, all the little like collaboration things.

George

Like there’s a, a super Mario set with hot wheels for the Mario cart. All this stuff is all part of this franchise.

Jon

Right. All the licensing. Just, just right.

George

Um,

Jon

Yep. Yep.

George

Strategy guides alone, 1.3 million strategy guides for Super Mario Brothers.

Jon

Crazy.

George

They’ve even got stats in here on YouTube but for Mario. I don’t know whose stats they’re using for the YouTube because they ain’t using ours, but $400 million dollars worth of YouTube, it said in the in the stats. i’m like It’s just nuts. All these different numbers.

George

To me, all it’s saying is if it weren’t for that little Jumpman character coming out of Donkey Kong and those two guys that Mo mentioned at the very beginning developing this Super Mario Brothers game,

Jon

yeah

George

You know, the video game industry could look very different today if it’s even there.

Mo

Oh, yeah. Yeah.

Jon

Oh, without a doubt, right. So I just kind of alluded a second ago. You look at the picture in North America. Now in Japan, video games are still doing okay, but we had had this crash caused by

Mo

No big time.

Jon

crazy just oversaturation of games and and systems from publishers.

Mo

Crappy quality too.

Jon

And so, right. And so we had that crash here in North America that brought the industry here to its knees. Atari had been the fastest growing company in the history of North of of of the United States.

Jon

And the the gaming industry it created dropped. What do we say in that backtrack? Like 96% of its value was lost in about six months, 96%, almost nothing.

Mo

Something like that. Yeah.

Jon

And it could have stayed dead. News outlets were saying it was a fad. Yeah, it was the hula hoop. We’re done with it. But then the NES, with thanks in no small part to the Pac-In game Super Mario Brothers, basically resurrected and spawned a phase two of a gaming industry that otherwise would not exist.

Jon

Maybe in North America, or you said, George, maybe not at all if it had petered out in Japan, but… Damn that little guy, little Jumpman, little red, blue.

George

Mm hmm.

Jon

but He was initially known, I said, as just Jumpman in Donkey Kong. He get a name until Donkey Kong Jr.

Mo

Oh, really?

Jon

Because you’ll remember in Donkey Kong Jr. go to Mario’s Hideout.

Mo

ah really

Jon

That’s one of the levels. They even say, you know, save your save Papa from Mario. Otherwise he was just Jumpman. ah he Mario got his name. It was at the Nintendo of America office and they were debating.

Jon

We wanted a better name for him than just Jumpman.

George

Yeah.

Jon

What are we going to call him? And during a meeting, the landlord interrupted the meeting and the landlord’s name, his first name was Mario. And they went, hey, maybe, maybe we just go with Mario.

George

Yep.

Jon

And so a legend was born.

George

It was a little dig. Yeah.

Jon

ah Right. like Like we had, he’s this little plumber, this little, he because over time he’s been what a carpenter, a plumber, a doctor, all these things. But back then in Mario, he was just a carpenter.

Mo

I

Jon

was like, he’s just a guy interrupting our business meeting. He’s just a guy with a wrench and a hammer. We’ll call him Mario.

Jon

Let’s see. I don’t know if we need the speed running and stuff. I don’t know if we’ve talked about that.

George

I don’t think we need it.

Mo

don’t care about that.

Jon

I think we can probably ditch that.

George

It was just something we were thinking about before.

Mo

Yeah.

Jon

We’re going to talk about all the characters. Yeah. ah tratortra Take this. We’re talking about the characters. Let me jump into this one.

Jon

Another thing that I had heard this in the past, but when I was digging and looking for history, there was a Q score survey. score was kind of like, you know it was a big clearinghouse for poles and stuff.

Mo

you

Jon

They did a survey in the early nineties that revealed that Mario was a more recognizable character to American children than Mickey Mouse. Than Mickey Mouse.

George

Yeah.

Jon

You know, and they went through things like a Ronald McDonald, Mickey Mouse, you know, all these different characters, and Mario was above Disney’s icon that people following forever.

Mo

Jeez. You know, this was the first game that actually was set in Mushroom World. I guess that’s what he called it. ah That’s Miyamoto’s.

Jon

Mm-hmm.

Mo

That’s like the first fantasy kingdom that he kind of designed in his head. And obviously this spawn kept going, growing and growing growing. Even to this day, it’s still around.

Jon

It allowed him to do anything. right He made this fantasy world that he keeps expanding on.

Mo

Yeah.

Jon

ah How about a mushroom that makes you grow double size? Sure. You just make stuff up. it doesn’t have to follow the real world, which I think is was is it’s it’s kind of like a cheat and also like a genius cheat.

Jon

It’s like, well, since we can’t do it exactly like the real world, we’ll just fake it and call it a fantasy, you know, ah this mushroom world that has its own rules to follow.

Mo

Yeah, oh sir yeah ah exactly.

Jon

And it worked out.

George

Well, it’s one of those things that, you know, you look back at it now and you’re like, oh, of course that makes sense. But when I think about it, mushroom world, what’s kid friendly about mushroom worlds, right?

Jon

Right, hindsight.

Jon

Ridiculous!

Mo

Right.

Jon

It’s silly!

George

Like mushrooms are fungus. There’s nothing appealing about them visually.

Mo

LSD, so I kept thinking of.

Jon

Right?

George

I mean, the yeah, they’re just, they’re just associated with all these things.

Jon

Psychedelics?

George

And, but I mean, for kids, why would kids, kids are looking at like candy canes and lollipops and stuff like, so John from Wreck-It Ralph, right?

Jon

Right. Mm-hmm.

George

That was candy land.

Jon

Yep.

George

That wasn’t mushroom land that they went to.

Jon

Exactly.

George

And that makes sense, but now you look back and you’re like, well, yeah, Toad is cute as hell, and he’s got his little head with the hat-looking mushroom cap on top.

Mo

Yeah.

Jon

Yeah.

George

and hey It’s just amazing how pervasive and how widespread the whole design mechanic is that started, really, with Super Mario. I’m not even going to say it started with Mario, because Mario Bros., like we said, black screen, neon colors, the little squishy POW button that you would hit your head into…

Jon

Right.

George

That did not bring the franchise forward.

Jon

Yep.

George

Super Mario Brothers absolutely established the world to Moe’s point.

Mo

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Jon

It did, yeah. that that It was that world, yeah. ah We talked about, well even Mario Brothers, you talked about the arcade game, right? That’s when he was a plumber and he was bouncing around, hitting his head against stuff.

George

Mm-hmm.

Jon

It helped to build the idea of um some of the mechanics, like how long you hold a button is how high you jump and the the physics of you know moving and sliding and that sort of thing. ah But ah we mentioned a little bit earlier that Super Mario Brothers introduced the side-scrolling platform game platform games in and of themselves had been around for a while even going back to the Atari days there was we had Donkey Kong hell we had things where you could run around on there or I’m drawing a blank on other on my computer I play Jumpman stuff like that platforms were fine but they didn’t scroll right yes of course with the Commodore they did of course

Mo

Yeah.

George

ah

George

Impossible Mission, right? Yeah.

Mo

They change screens. They didn’t scroll like you go to a different screen.

George

Exactly.

Mo

Yeah, yeah.

Jon

And the difference that creates is when you go screen to screen, what do you talk about? Well, oh I’m on the blue level. I’m on the red level.

Mo

Mm hmm.

George

John, your favorite, one of your favorite games of all time didn’t didn’t scroll.

Jon

This is a world.

George

Pitfall.

Jon

That’s right.

Mo

That’s right.

Jon

Just jump from screen to screen.

Mo

This group.

Jon

Yeah.

George

Yeah.

Jon

Right.

Mo

um on the vine level, on the…

Jon

Right. now Pitfall 2 added a little scrolling.

Mo

Yeah.

Jon

Right.

George

Sure.

Jon

Yeah. Yeah. But in reaction to. Right.

Mo

yeah Geez. One thing I always wondered, though, is like they never actually explain what Mario is doing, like how he got there, right? He was just… He’s just there, right? Essentially.

Mo

you

Jon

Well, got to save the princess. That’s it. Yeah.

George

Yeah.

Mo

know, he’s a plumber. How the hell he get there?

George

Well, that’s the thing, though.

Mo

Yeah.

Jon

Yeah.

George

I think back then, you didn’t need all the exposition as long as the gameplay and the mechanics were fun.

Mo

Yeah.

Jon

Yeah.

George

it It was also a leap in graphic technology, right, Mo?

Mo

sure

Mo

Oh, yeah. I mean, like I said before, like they did so many cost savings or say memory savings things in the game.

Jon

yeah yeah

Mo

um Like the music was actually run, I think, on the CPU. They were able to figure that out. So it saved more programming space, you know?

Jon

Oh, okay.

George

Mm-hmm.

Mo

And the other thing is like I said, like if you look at the clouds in the bushes, they’re the exact same sprite. They’re just different colors.

Jon

The color map changed.

George

Oh.

Jon

Yeah. I remember seeing a video on that and no, it’s not.

Mo

But I…

Mo

Yeah, exactly.

Jon

And I fired, they’re cheating.

Mo

I’m like, yeah, I did the same thing.

Jon

And I launched it I’m like, I’ll be damned.

Mo

I said, no i I had to pull up a screen. I’m like, let me look at this. I’m like, well, shoot, that’s clever.

Jon

Okay. We’ve touched on some of the things that make it so notable, but why was it so popular? Why was it so successful? That’s what we’re going to try to figure out right after this break. Stick around.

Jon

In 1985, when Super Mario Bros. was released alongside the Super… Three, two. In 1985, when Super Mario Bros…. Damn it! Well, there’s the blooper.

Jon

In 1985, when Super Mario Brothers was released as a pack-in for the Nintendo Entertainment System, we’d already said 1983 would have that crash in North America. This kind of revitalized it, so we see why it’s so beloved.

Jon

It was incredibly high-value pack-in game. Sometimes they just throw in what’s available, what’s ready.

Mo

hmm. Mm hmm.

George

Mm-hmm.

Jon

We all love combat or air-sea battle on our Atari. They’re not the cutting edge of gaming. They’re just interesting, fun, you know distraction to do. So we can see why it might’ve been popular and prevalent, but what made it so long lasting and so popular and successful there? I think we found there are a few possible reasons that contributed to that.

George

Yeah, I think the first one is probably approachability, right? So the game levels, especially, you know, 1-1, they taught player the mechanics of the game.

Jon

Hmm.

Jon

Hmm.

George

And in a progressive introduction, clever environmental puzzles set the high standard for platforming level design because, you know, There really wasn’t that much put into platforming games before this, but overall the pacing as well.

Jon

Right?

George

John, you talked a little bit earlier about the different music tracks and how they would pull you along. Mo talked about how that would make you want to play longer, like he got tied in and he didn’t want to even leave the house when he was coming home from college.

George

I mean that’s some crazy shit when you live in New York and you’re coming home from college and you don’t want to go to the bars. You want to sit there and play Mario. That’s an addictive game. And it’s addictive because it’s very ah approachable.

Mo

yeah

George

You can pick up Mario Brothers and even me, who barely can get past World 1-3. I suck at this game, but I love it because I can sit there and pick it up and I can start playing immediately and find some level of success, even on that 1-1 level.

George

Now, I don’t know why, but I can never grab that goddamn flag at the top of the flagpole. I’m always on the bottom of the flagpole when I hit that thing. But it is such an approachable game that it made it easy for young people and old people to sit down and play.

Jon

Mm-hmm.

Mo

yeah

George

This is a game that I would argue that young kids in 85 could sit and play with their parents even.

Mo

Oh,

Mo

yeah

Jon

Mm-hmm.

George

And parents in 85 were very unlikely to play a video game with their kid. Like, if anything, maybe my father would have played some pinball with me at the most.

Mo

oh yeah

Jon

Yeah.

George

And you’d have to go to an arcade. We couldn’t do that at home. But I’m sure that had we bought a Nintendo Entertainment System in 85, I’m 100% convinced I could have talked my mother into sitting on the floor with me in front of the TV and playing Mario because it’s so cute.

Jon

Ha!

George

It’s so fun. The deaths even are cute and fun with the… And the little one he pops up off the screen and falls down.

Jon

do doo doo do do doo do doo

George

Yeah, it’s it’s nothing vulgar. It’s just very approachable on several different levels.

Jon

Yeah, yeah. i You know, to that end, you know, because you’d mentioned this when we were prepping for the show, I went digging and I found a video that kind of broke down. How does level 1.1, I’m not going to rehash the whole video, but interesting things like you spend most of the game mid-screen, you know, as things scroll in front of you and behind you.

Mo

Yeah. Mm-hmm.

George

hmm.

Mo

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Jon

But the game starts with you on the far, far left with a wide open field.

Mo

z

George

yeahp

Jon

to urge you to explore to the right, to teach you you’re scrolling right.

George

he

Jon

As you scroll, the first thing you encounter is that flashing question mark block. It’s not approaching you. It’s just blinking. It’s it’s it’s inquisitive. it has a question mark. It tells you there’s something to find there.

Jon

You take another step and the first Goomba comes across. Now, at this point, if you haven’t read the manual, you don’t know you can jump. You can’t get past that Goomba without learning to jump.

George

Mm hmm.

Jon

And when you do, you’re rewarded.

Mo

Right.

Jon

Then when the first mushroom pops up, you’re kind of boxed in.

Mo

hmm.

Jon

So you almost have to get the mushroom. It’s hard to avoid without going around. So it’s to teach you that you can power up with the mushroom. Since they just gave you a monster that looked like a mushroom that hurt you, they had to teach you this mushroom was good.

Jon

And it goes on with like teaching you like the next bit or pipes that get slightly taller to teach you the longer you hold down the button, the higher you jump.

George

who

Jon

There was no pop up text. It didn’t say now player hold down the button. No, no.

George

Right.

Jon

To get through these steps, it held your hand almost like a tutorial these days without, you know, when you’re going through one. How approachable is that? To your point, George, it’s incredible.

Mo

Yeah, that’s crazy.

George

It may be the greatest tutorial without being a tutorial in gaming history.

Jon

i Yeah, right up there.

Mo

Oh, yeah. I mean, they definitely, I mean, that set the standard, right? And top for games going forward.

Jon

Yep.

Mo

But just the, like, John, you brought some of the mechanics. you know You know, the fact that it a first side-scroller, you know, they had to think about that.

Jon

Yep.

Mo

Like, how do you get people to move to the right? How do you tell them to move right without telling them to? But it had things like, you know, your jumping had to be, like, to jump on top of a Goomba, you had to time your jump just right.

George

Mm-hmm.

Jon

Mm-hmm.

Mo

the longer you held down the jump button.

Jon

Oh, and you can adjust your velocity like midair.

Mo

Right.

Jon

Like you can you can kind of you put English on it.

Mo

Oh, yeah. yeah

Jon

Like you’re in the air, you hold back, you can kind of oh, weird stuff.

Mo

Oh, absolutely.

Jon

Yeah, that’s neat.

Mo

yeah And the other thing was that it had that variable speed acceleration. Like you didn’t you didn’t go with zero to 60.

Jon

Yeah.

Mo

You kind of sped up a little bit. And I know like i used to have fun just going back and forth just to watch it like and then go back the other way and then speed up and go back the other way.

George

Yeah, the sliding thing drives me nuts. Even to this day, i can’t precisely decide where I’m going to land or stick.

Jon

Damn it, inertia. Yeah.

George

He just slides all over the place like he’s on ice.

Mo

yeah And of course now, which is standard across every game pretty much, is like the power of system. The fact that you can make your character, give him new abilities temporarily, you know, that he didn’t have before to get past this thing.

George

Hmm.

Jon

Yeah. Right.

Mo

Like you can make stuff invulnerable, so you can do this. You can make yourself huge, so make it easy to get past these levels. You know, all these things that today are just standard were groundbreaking back then.

George

I think the power-up thing was a variation based off of Galaga.

Jon

Yeah.

Mo

Oh, mean this double ship kind of deal?

Jon

the The double shooter kind of thing.

George

Yeah, because the double shooter is definitely a power-up move in Galaga, and you can lose it just like, you know, you can be big in Mario and then you can get hit somebody and shrink down.

Jon

Yeah.

Jon

Mm-hmm.

Jon

Yeah.

George

i I don’t know that they, you know, like looked at Galaga, oh, we’ve got to incorporate that, but it just feels like a natural evolution from that kind of a place.

Mo

Mm-hmm.

Jon

Well, there’s a number of things they could have. But like in Galaga, and the other example I thought of was Pac-Man, the power pellet can make you invulnerable like a star and, you know…

Mo

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Jon

But it’s it’s also momentary.

George

Oh, yeah, that’s a good power-up, right? Yeah.

Jon

Yeah, it’s also a power up of sorts, right? But to have a system whereby, oh, I can become big and I’m big until I get hit. Or I can get the Fire Flower and I’m this size and I have this ability.

Mo

Right.

Jon

It’s not timed, right? ah or Like Galaga, you’d have to lose the ship, right?

George

Well, some of them are.

Jon

Some of them are, like the the star is, right?

George

Yeah.

Jon

ah But it has you had to learn. you had to learn, well, how long does mushroom last? How can I do it? In later games, they would let you bank those ah those things. Like, oh, I have a mushroom in reserve in case I need one. It became part of that system where you continue to have that stuff.

Jon

And I mentioned earlier, I just got to shout out ah Koji Kondo’s soundtrack again.

Mo

she

Jon

for a game that I’m just so accustomed to, even arcade games would have a cute little dingy ding melody and that’s it.

Mo

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Jon

And this this was just a series of tracks that brought life to different worlds and different environments and clued you in as to like, oh, it’s the underground was like, it was a little more ominous, was a little scarier down there.

Mo

he

Jon

All it was was different color palette, but by adding that extra sound, it added like, oh I’m in a different place. And um my it’s just as you listen through go and find it.

Jon

We’ll put a link we’ll try to find a link for you. You can go and find this whole soundtrack and listen to appreciate just how many different scores and songs were created by Kondo to give this game more life than any game I had played before.

Mo

Okay.

Jon

Certainly.

Mo

Oh, for sure.

George

I think the soundtrack also was instructional.

Mo

Mm-hmm.

Jon

Mm hmm. Yeah.

George

right?

Jon

Right.

George

The, the hurry up sound that the pace of that hurry up sound in that alarming, you know, few first few notes of that I was playing, ah in preparation for this podcast, I wanted to see if I could get past one, three and I didn’t, but if one, two, I was playing around in that underworld thing and I’m like going around and I’m, I’m just kind of exploring.

Jon

Right.

Jon

da

Jon

its Just make sure.

George

Let me hit all the blocks. Cause there’s always like a little hidden shit that you don’t know is there.

Jon

Yep.

George

And I know Mo’s going to talk about that in a little while, but um I’m going around and I was almost out of time and it was like, and I’m like, Oh my God, I got to get to the, and I got to the end and I’m like, Oh crap, I got to go upstairs now.

Mo

Yeah.

George

And I got to jump on the, Oh, but it was that sound is what alerted me to the fact that I’m about to die.

Jon

right In a way that just an on-screen timer doesn’t do.

George

If I don’t get a move on.

Mo

Yeah.

George

Exactly. Exactly.

Jon

Yeah.

Mo

yeah And George, you mentioned kind of like hidden stuff. I mean, you could run through the whole level and get be done. You know just go left to right and jump and do all your stuff you need to.

Mo

But I remember first time you’re playing, like you’re going right. and You’re like, wait a minute, up to the left, there’s a ledge or something.

Jon

Yeah. Yeah, right.

Mo

And you’re like, why was that there?

Jon

Like, wait a minute.

Mo

Like, it made no sense almost. Like, why would that be there? And maybe the first time you play, you don’t care. But the second time you’re playing, you’re like, what’s up there? You jump up, they realize ah it’s a whole secret area.

Jon

yeah

George

yeah

Mo

that you didn’t even see before, you know? And there’s hidden stuff everywhere in this. And people remember this was pre-internet days when you couldn’t just go online and look them up, right?

Mo

You had to either get these guides, you you had friends that said, hey, did you hit the secret level blah, blah, blah.

George

no

Mo

And they’re like, what do you mean there’s secret level there, you know?

Jon

the The what? What are you talking about?

Mo

um And so it was word of mouth. And that just kept people coming back and back and back and playing this game over and over again.

Jon

Yeah.

Jon

Yeah, I remember, like again, my girlfriend’s little brother would say, youre like, oh, let me show you the warp level. like What do you mean? What are you talking about?

Mo

Yeah.

Jon

Oh, look, you jump up here on this thing, and then you end up on the top of the world, and you’re up there where the score is, and you run across, and you get down, like, wait a minute. this whole How did you find this? Oh, I just played around all day. and Because literally, he was always in trouble for playing it all day and not doing his chores and things like that. but I think his juvenile delinquency speaks to the dramatic appeal, that that addictive nature, the feeling of exploration, all those things. As we said, why was it so popular and so successful?

Jon

It was a perfect storm. It was lightning in a bottle. All these things hit at the same time in one game. And why is it the biggest selling video game of all time? As George just told us, here’s why.

Mo

Yeah. Yeah.

Jon

Because even still today, it’s so damn good. And in fact, in the next segment, we get back from this break. We’re going talk about how much impact it continues to have today in games and media and pop culture and damn near everything.

Jon

So but hurry back.

Mo

Mm-hmm.

Jon

So, Super Mario Bros., an astounding game, still popular today, and that was the end of a franchise. Too bad, so sad, end of the podcast. Psych! Not quite.

George

Mm-hmm.

Jon

First of all, its own sequels. It was a video game piece of media, and it spawned all sorts of follow-ups and sequels. And… I just i made a laundry list here.

Jon

You guys stop me when you think of one you want to talk about. But I left out the ones that were related to the Mario world and Mushroom World and stuff.

Mo

just

Jon

These are just literally Super Mario or Mario platformer games. ah The Lost, well, after Super Mario Brothers, we had the Lost Levels. We had Super Mario Brothers 2, Super Mario Brothers 3, Super Mario Land, Super Mario World.

George

you’re going to have to speed this up, sir. We’re never going to finish this podcast.

Mo

Yeah, exactly. We’d be here all hours just going through this.

Jon

There’s a lot of them Super Mario Land 2, Super Mario 64, launch title for the Nintendo 64, Super Mario Sunshine, the new Super Mario Brothers, Super Mario Galaxy, Super Mario Brothers Wii, Super Mario Galaxy 2, Super Mario 3D Land, new Super Mario Brothers 2, and the second sequel of that, the one on the Wii U, Super Mario 3D World, Super Mario Maker, Odyssey, Maker 2, Super Mario Wonder.

Jon

And all those others that came out. Are you kidding me? Are you kidding And by the way, three for three consoles, Super Mario game was the pack-in for each of those consoles. NES, SNES, N64.

Mo

Geez. Yeah.

Jon

Yeah.

George

It just looks to me like they had word soup up on a magnetic board with little… And they just kept rearranging the words to come up with the next game.

Jon

Just as long as you got Super Mario in there, we’ll do it.

George

Right. Yeah.

Jon

What do you got?

Mo

yeah

Jon

Super Mario basketball. Okay. Super Mario ah pipe fitting. Sure. Whatever you got. They can do it. ah OK, some of the sequels. We had toys and games. And you know what?

Jon

I’m not going to list them. Anything you can imagine, there is a Super Mario branded version.

Mo

Absolutely.

George

Probably, yeah.

Jon

Pie plate, cookie jar, sheets, dog warmer, whatever you need, whatever you need, whatever. Is that a thing? I don’t know if there is. There’s a Mario version of it.

George

Is there a lunchbox I can hit somebody with on the playground?

Jon

Yeah, there’s several different varieties. ah There’s the metal and the plastic, and you have variety of designs to choose from.

George

and Okay. Metal is what we need, but yeah.

Jon

Yeah. yeah Well, you can fill the plastic with rocks, and it doesn’t bend. so

George

Oh, yeah, yeah, true, true.

Jon

Yeah, this is interesting. um We do…

George

but just Just fill it up with cement.

Jon

wait

George

Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha.

Mo

that’s why Well, skip rocks.

Jon

Cut out the middleman, says George. ah We talked about it years ago in our Saturday morning cereal. Well, we talked years ago in our ah breakfast cereal backtrack about all the different cereals.

Jon

There was a Nintendo cereal system in 88, and the box art was like half Mario, half Zelda. I was looking.

George

Mm-hmm.

Jon

Yeah, remember that stuff? The Super Mario system? it was It was just regular old cornflakes or like ah corn puff cereals, all it was. Yeah. ah and They still come out with Mario serials every once in a while.

Jon

like like Seasonally, when new games come out, I noticed. that I was searching that. George, you alluded earlier about the movies. You had said, oh, and movies and the money made for movies.

George

e

Jon

Well, in 93, we did have the first Super Mario Brothers movie with Bob Hoskins, John Leguizamo, and Dennis Hopper, which…

Mo

Oh, geez. Yeah.

George

Mm-hmm.

Jon

I suppose made them some money just because kids were nuts about Super Mario.

Mo

Yeah.

Jon

But um then in 2023, we got the Super Mario Brothers movie, the modern one with Chris Pratt voicing Mario. And I’m on point Seth Rogen as Donkey Kong.

Jon

I’m not sure how i feel about that still, but it kind of fits. It kind of does.

Jon

Yeah. And there’s a there’s a new one coming. They just announced the other day. You had that on your on bit by bit news, right, George?

George

Yeah, Super Mario Galaxy is coming out in 2026.

Jon

Oh, basically. Yeah. Yep.

George

Yeah.

Jon

Next year. That’s that’s right around the corner. And they’re going to make another billion dollars.

George

And people are up at arms about the casting and the decisions of the plot already. People are losing their shit.

Mo

Jeez.

George

It’s an animated cartoon, and they’re mad as hell that this character wasn’t, and we skipped this, and why don’t we get that, and blah, blah, blah. People are serious about this thing.

Jon

Yeah, well, yeah, nobody half loves Mario, right? People like, if they love it, they love it.

George

Mm-mm.

Jon

And it’s an enthusiastic fandom. ah So we talked about the movies, cartoons, the cartoons, and a lot of these cartoons, I’m in the laundry list, I’ll skip some of these, but just to get a flavor, some of them were just in Japan, but going all the way back to the Saturday Supercade in 1983, predating Super Mario Brothers, we had Mario themed cartoons in the Saturday Supercade because he was in Donkey Kong.

Mo

Oh, geez.

Jon

But then we had the Super Mario Brothers show in 89, Captain in the Game Master in 89, Club Mario in 90, Adventures of Super Mario Brothers 3, round that sequel, Super Mario Brothers Challenge in 90, Mario Club in 90, Mario World in 90, Super Mario All-Stars in 94.

Mo

Yeah, me either.

Jon

um There was a 64 Mario Stadium in 1996 to celebrate that. Mario School, as recently as 2000, a series, a cartoon animated series that came out.

George

Wow.

Jon

And I haven’t seen even a third of these, but look, if kids are going to love the games, they’re going to love the cartoons.

Mo

yeah i mean either

George

Mm-mm.

Jon

They’re going to watch it’s going to bring in advertisers. So it’s a no brainer.

Mo

yeah

Jon

Why wouldn’t you have all those things? And was interesting when I went through them, a lot of them were themed around the launch of particular games. My brothers, three 64, things like that.

George

Oh, yeah.

Mo

Oh, yeah.

Jon

Like let’s spin up another cartoon because we have a new franchise or new, a new entry in the franchise to talk about.

George

Yeah.

Jon

Right. Oh, let’s see. What’s the last thing we listed to look at is the theme parks, which is a pretty relatively new, a new thing. And I have not been to one yet.

Jon

Not so much interest of the Mario part, but the Donkey Kong part looks awesome. But they’re they’re not called Mario. They’re called Super Nintendo World is what these parks are called.

George

Right.

Jon

There are three of them. They’re heavily inspired by Super Mario Brothers and that Mushroom Kingdom. um There’s one at Universal Studios in California. There’s one at Universal Japan. And most recently just opened just south of us a couple hours.

Jon

Universal um Epic Adventure, Epic Universal, Epic Universe in Orlando, Florida. One of those worlds is the Super Mario or the Super Nintendo world. And have you seen footage of this thing?

Mo

No, I haven’t.

Jon

It’s like stepping into the game.

George

Oh yeah. Yeah.

Mo

Really?

George

So think about this. So when you’re talking about things that, uh, childhood toys or games, there’s only two that have been turned into theme park lands or their own theme parks, Lego land, super Nintendo.

Mo

ah really?

Jon

Mm-hmm. Okay.

Mo

Makes sense.

George

That’s it.

Jon

Yeah.

George

Right? The two largest childhood franchises in history and their genres have been made into theme parks. Nothing else. ah like I’m not going to say Disney is a game.

George

It is the largest theme park, but it’s not a game.

Jon

No. sir

Mo

No. No,

George

There’s no game in that.

Mo

No.

Jon

Right.

George

They’ve tried to do games and they’ve sucked, but…

Jon

It’s a few. Okay. Okay.

George

when uh you know super nintendo is obviously the dominant force in the gaming world and their theme part it so john you talked about the donkey kong part is most this is obviously all for mario and his people you don’t see a duck hunt ride at super nintendo world right

Jon

okay

Jon

Yeah.

Jon

That’s right. Right. Where’s the greatest ride? Where’s the, yeah.

Mo

yeah

George

yeah

Jon

ah none None of those other things are in there, right? It’s, ah it’s, it’s staggering. And it’s the fact that it’s, continued If it was just a flash in the pan, it it wrapped up in, you know, late 80s, early 90s. Oh, there was a sequel. Maybe we’ll have a resurgence in the mid 90s.

Jon

It’s never died down. There’s always a demand for what’s the next Mario whatever.

Mo

Yeah. Mm-hmm.

Jon

Is it a game? Is it a movie? Is it a theme park? Is it a toy? Is it a? It’s like Batman. You know, everybody in their own and their cousin has a Batman t-shirt with a Batman emblem. Or Star Wars, a Star Wars logo.

Jon

Mario is a common thing to see on any average person. I don’t think you can walk and walk in a mall anywhere in America, or the world maybe, without running into a couple of people that have a Mario t-shirt. It’s just universally beloved.

Jon

for I mean, it’s it’s kind of overwhelming that it’s so, so powerful.

Mo

Yeah.

Jon

so those things All right, gentlemen. We could have talked about more, as Mo said, in the research that he did. But I think this gives you a nice snapshot of what is so special about Super Mario Brothers.

Jon

and that makes me want to go pop it in and play it again, you know, right now. See if I get past, mainly to see if I get past 1-3 and beat George.

Mo

Went three. Right.

Jon

That’s kind of my, that’s that’s my thought.

George

Yeah. That’s the mark.

Jon

Is it? I get there, just screenshot, I can turn it off.

Mo

right

Jon

That’s it.

Jon

Before we leave you, I want to thank a brand new Patreon that supports us over at patreon.com. Scott Look, he did what we talk about all the time.

Mo

Thank you.

Jon

He headed over to genxgrownup.com slash Patreon because he watches our YouTube content or listens to the podcast, enjoys what we do and wants to support it and ensure we can continue to do it. Scott, thank you so much for your generosity. You know you’re joining a roster of amazing people that continue and have supported us for years and allows us to keep bringing you stories.

Jon

allows us to keep bringing you shows like this about beloved franchises that we love growing up. Thank you, Scott. Thank you, everyone that does that. On that good note, it’s time to wrap up this edition of the show. Don’t worry, though. We’ll be back in two weeks with another backtrack. Next week is the standard edition of our show.

Jon

Until then, I’m John George. Thank you so much for being here, man.

George

Yes, sir.

Jon

Mo, you know I appreciate you, brother.

Mo

Always fun.

Jon

Fourth listener, it’s you. We all appreciate most of all, though, and we can’t wait to talk to you again next time. Bye-bye.

George

See you guys.

Mo

Take care, everybody.

George

Now we need to run over to our YouTube channel real quick and make sure that my video has done 14,000 views like John’s did.

Jon

I’ll check.

Mo

oh

Jon

It’s doing all right. i’m um A lot of good feedback. I was had a little anxiety about it, but it’s it’s performed quite well and good feedback on it.

George

i I was shocked at the length. Like, I just clicked it on the premiere and let it sit, but an hour and a half, i was like, what the fuck is he thinking?

Jon

I know. Me too.

Jon

I know.

Mo

Yeah, I know.

Jon

I know. Yeah. Yeah.

George

So are you going to have a lot more bites at the apple, or are you just doing the one?

Jon

It’s really hurting it.

Jon

Oh, it’s tons. Tons. Yeah.

George

Okay. Okay.

Jon

Yep. Yep. Yep. Yeah.

Mo

geez.

Jon

Oh, is it? It was 14 when I came in here.

George

Yeah, that’s it.

Jon

Mm-hmm.

George

I mean, it was at one point it was doing well over a thousand an hour. And then like overnight, it was around like 500 or so an hour, but it was still moving strong.

Mo

So cranking.

George

And obviously plenty of subscribers.

Jon

yeah it’s it yeah Yeah, this morning it’s still about 500 hours.

George

I think it was like 50 when I went to sleep or something.

Jon

So, yeah.

Mo

yeah Over 400, almost 400 comments.

George

Yeah.

Jon

ah yeah And we’ll get another surge when it starts shipping mid-October. And we should get another surge nearing Christmas as people are shopping because it’s a big item. We’re going to go looking for reviews. So I think we’ll do well.

George

Especially if we do that video we were talking about with the holiday wish list thing and throw that at the top of it.

Jon

Mm-hmm.

Mo

oh yeah yeah

Jon

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Mo

ah smart

Jon

We’re talking about maybe yeah compiling some stuff and doing a video holiday gift guide. Yeah.

George

Yeah, the lady from Game suggested that we do one of those and put affiliate links for all the different things for Walmart and Amazon in the description to try and generate some revenue.

Mo

Okay.

Jon

Yeah. We don’t have a Walmart affiliate thing yet, so we’ll have to get that set up. I didn’t know they did it.

George

Now I have to talk with her and find that out.

Jon

Okay.

Mo

ah Okay.

Jon

right, promo real quick.

Mo

Okay.

Jon

You guys good?

George

Yep. I’m good.

Jon

Promo in 5, 4, 3. four three On this backtrack edition of the Gen X Grown Up Podcast, we’re celebrating a true milestone in gaming history, the 40th anniversary of Super Mario Brothers.

George

The 85 Classic didn’t just put Nintendo on the map, it redefined what video games could be, inspiring generations of players.

Jon

Hmm.

Mo

We’ll discuss its legacy, explore how it became a cultural icon, and look at why Mario’s first big adventure still holds up all these years later.

Jon

Beautiful. Tick, tick, tick. Hitting stop.